2025-05-05.log

- L29Ah (PART: !!unknown attribute: msg!!) (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah)00:06
+ L29Ah (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah)00:18
gordon1(easy to do for people with soldering skills though)00:37
gordon1>00:37
gordon1pair of snips also works if you're careful00:37
gordon1(but don't blame me if you lift some tracks with that pls!)00:38
minuteplease don't ^^00:50
minuteyou just need a medium-big blob of solder on the tip of a soldering iron. with that you can just heat and wiggle away a 0603 component.00:51
gordon1yeah that works too, works better with chipquick low temp solder for rework00:53
gordon1and bigger soldering iron tip00:55
vagrantcminute: so the resistor to remove is on the rcore module or the reform2 motherboard?01:07
minutegordon1: yep01:08
minutevagrantc: on the motherboard. idk the designator by hand, but it's a 100k pulldown to gnd on the EDP_RESET line01:08
minutethis signal isn't connected on rcore (but will be on rcore v2)01:09
minuteso, sn65dsi86 will stay in reset01:09
minuteif one removes the resistor it works, because the reset isn't strictly required 01:10
minute(and it has a weak internal pullup)01:10
vagrantcor i just leave the hdmi adapter board in for now :)01:11
minuteyes01:16
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+ chomwitt (~chomwitt@2a02:587:7a24:7f00:1ac0:4dff:fedb:a3f1)07:02
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+ aperezdc (~aperezdc@46.23.89.43)09:45
joschthird person now asking me about the Reform in the train today09:47
joschtwo of them very excited: "omg this is exactly what i have been looking for!"09:47
[tj]thats cool, I would hate it10:21
josch[tj]: the questions?10:45
[tj]yeah, I have quite a small allowance for people focusing on what I'm doing in public10:46
[tj]I find posting any picture with the pocket quite annoying10:46
[tj]even if I include what it is I get a bunch of "what is that laptop" questions10:47
joschooooh i see10:47
joschfor me, I really enjoy bragging about my laptop :)10:48
[tj]I don't like having to justify myself10:48
joschof course, fair10:49
- jacobk (QUIT: Ping timeout: 276 seconds) (~quassel@47-186-65-73.dlls.tx.frontiernet.net)11:04
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+ mjw (~mjw@gnu.wildebeest.org)12:38
+ andreas-e (~Andreas@2001:861:c4:f2f0::c64)12:42
+ paperManu (~paperManu@172.93.30.55)12:43
- chomwitt (QUIT: Ping timeout: 244 seconds) (~chomwitt@2a02:587:7a24:7f00:1ac0:4dff:fedb:a3f1)12:48
+ chomwitt (~chomwitt@2a02:85f:9a0f:2600:1ac0:4dff:fedb:a3f1)12:50
+ gustav28 (~gustav@c-78-82-38-134.bbcust.telenor.se)13:02
- cobra (QUIT: Ping timeout: 276 seconds) (~cobra@user/Cobra)13:10
grimmwareI think with the Pocket people ask more questions which imply that they don't think the size is sensible13:19
grimmware"What do you use it for?" is another one which I dunno if you might get for the full reform13:20
grimmware"Can you type on that?"13:21
chorcI've used my Pocket just for one train trip, and there were just two people in the car, but they did ask me about it, I blame clicky keyboard :)13:37
zehawell, i was in a conference room with a lot of nerds, a lot of them asked :D13:38
joschwe had three reforms at the conference -- the number is certainly going up every year ;)13:51
zehaa lot of reform next pitching was happening ;)13:54
joschhey, my MNT t-shirt was the only clean one i had left the day of my talk -- i had no choice!! :D13:55
[tj]grimmware: "how can you type on that, my hands are too big"13:55
[tj]which is an incredible statement to make to someone else about their computer13:57
- chomwitt (QUIT: Ping timeout: 276 seconds) (~chomwitt@2a02:85f:9a0f:2600:1ac0:4dff:fedb:a3f1)13:57
joschi haven't heard that one yet but i hear that all the time about my display: "how can you see anything on this?? it is way too small for my eyes!!"13:59
chorchaha, that's kind of an advantage14:02
sigrid17” mnt reform when14:03
joschpocket reform cluster inside 17" reform14:04
sigrid"three pocket reforms in a trenchcoat"14:04
joschXD14:04
zehajosch: :D14:10
joschwas really nice to finally meet you there14:11
joschbeing able to put a face to the nickname helps a lot :D14:11
- L29Ah (PART: !!unknown attribute: msg!!) (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah)14:14
zehaindeed!14:20
zehaso, likewise & likewise :)14:20
jfredI enjoy the questions I get about my Pocket Reform, but I haven't brought one to a tech conference yet so it's not too overwhelming15:02
jfredMostly people think it's cool, when I get asked what I use it for they get it when I say I mostly use it for writing/blogging/taking notes15:03
jfredbecause it fits in with distraction-free writing devices a lot (even though it can do more than those)15:03
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+ bkeys (~Thunderbi@38-146-94-247.echocast.zone)15:21
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+ bkeys1 (~Thunderbi@38-146-94-247.echocast.zone)15:46
grimmwareI've taken it to a couple of conferences before, I get varying levels of interest15:48
- bkeys1 (QUIT: Read error: Connection reset by peer) (~Thunderbi@38-146-94-247.echocast.zone)15:49
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+ bkeys (~Thunderbi@66.110.201.50)17:29
+ L29Ah (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah)17:31
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+ manis (01a66df340@185.72.67.185)18:31
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- robin (QUIT: Remote host closed the connection) (~robin@user/terpri)19:00
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- iank_ (QUIT: Quit: ZNC 1.8.2+deb2+deb11u1 - https://znc.in) (~iank@fsf/staff/iank)19:32
+ iank (~iank@fsf/staff/iank)19:32
+ vagrantc (~vagrant@2600:3c01:e000:21:7:77:0:50)19:35
minutehaha, reading log here19:38
minutethanks for amusing anecdotes around minidebconf!19:39
minutei'm testing 6.14 build on all kinds of devices r/n because i'd like to release that kernel...19:39
vagrantcwahooo19:45
minutehmmm dsi display flicker on a311d, i thought we had a afbc-disabling patch... maybe it's not in my stack?19:46
+ ephase (~ephase@2a01:e0a:2a:5300:37e6:956d:e15c:25fc)19:50
+ bkeys (~Thunderbi@66.110.201.50)20:02
joschminute: about releasing soon... could we use reform-tools postinst hackery to move people on HDMI rk3588 reform to a dtb that has a HDMI prefix so that the DSI variant can live without it?20:07
vagrantcchanging what is in upstream linux is bad form...20:07
vagrantcnot that it does not happen ... but ugh.20:08
minutejosch: why like this?20:08
minutejosch: i mean, why change the default?20:09
joschis the default not changing now?20:09
joschyou are no longer selling HDMI classic reform with rk3588, no?20:09
joschso you sold X units and that's all that there ever will be20:09
joschif there are going to be two dtbs, seems strange that the default is the one with the special prefix20:10
vagrantcbetter to switch both if it is really that troublesome20:11
minutehttps://mntre.com/documentation/reform-handbook/software.html#flashing-the-system-image20:11
joschah :D20:11
minutereform-system-rk3588-dsi.img.gz is already in the 3rd edition handbook now that is also already in print :D20:11
joschwell, never mind20:11
minutemaybe we can converge on reform3 later or something20:11
joschreform3? :D20:12
vagrantcjosch: it also makes for hairy problems with flash-kernel and the likes20:12
joschvagrantc: yes, that's why i called any attempt to do this hackery20:12
joschbut if the printed handbook has it, then there is no point to talk more about this20:13
- robin (QUIT: Ping timeout: 276 seconds) (~robin@user/terpri)20:14
vagrantcsimilarly once a .dts is accepted in mainline linux ... i would not want to change what it means20:15
- bkeys (QUIT: Ping timeout: 252 seconds) (~Thunderbi@66.110.201.50)20:18
joschvagrantc: my hope was that it would somehow be easily possible to have one device tree for both configurations20:27
joschbut i read earlier today that you need to remove a resistor for that to potentially work20:27
vagrantcah, yeah, a single device-tree supporting multiple variants woudl be nicer ... but do not seem to be there.20:29
minutea311d pocket with display v1 and also over hdmi has no flicker, so it was probably the display i grabbed here to test... will try again with another v220:33
minuteotherwise we're good, everything else works fine20:34
joschnice20:41
joschsorry for the negativity on the dtb topic from me20:41
joschi don't want to be a hindrance in getting more reforms into user's hands20:42
joschhttps://source.mnt.re/reform/reform-tools/-/merge_requests/118 only needs an another u-boot build for rk3588 dsi reform20:45
minutejosch: no problem, it's legit criticism. ah, thanks about the u-boot reminder.20:48
minutejosch: hmm i'm still running into a311d flicker issue, but only on display v2 on pocket reform, for example when reloading mntre.com in firefox20:48
minutejosch: hm, afbc patch doesn't seem to be in my patchstack20:49
xktrGood morning -- I have a first gen Refrom laptop with the original boundary devices freescale module.  I'm trying to obtain a current image for it, and am trying to the official system image release link from https://mnt.re/docs-all.html.  For the original system module, would I use the image "reform-system-imx8mq.img.gz"?20:50
minuteyeah, this one i need to pull in https://source.mnt.re/reform/reform-debian-packages/-/blob/main/linux/patches6.12/meson-g12b-bananapi-cm4-mnt-reform2/0030-WORKAROUND-meson-plane-disable-afbc-32x8.patch?ref_type=heads20:50
+ robin (~robin@user/terpri)20:50
minutexktr: hi, yes, you can grab it from https://mnt.re/system-image20:51
minutexktr: 8mq is the right one20:51
xktrminute: Thank you.  Is there any additional preparation required for the sdcard, or can I just dd if=path/to/image of=/dev/sdcardblockid ?20:52
joschminute: when i rebase the patch stack, then I usually run something like this and it will show me patches that got completely removed and lets me check whether that was intentional or not: git diff --no-index linux/patches6.12 linux/patches6.14 --stat20:53
minutexktr: you can do that, or more comfortably you can use bmaptool copy https://source.mnt.re/reform/reform-system-image/-/jobs/9650/artifacts/raw/reform-system-imx8mq.img.gz /dev/sdX20:53
minutejosch: mhm!20:53
minutejosch: huh, there's a bunch of stuff seemingly gone... need to check20:54
xktrminute: I may be running into a problem then.  I had an sdcard with the mnt v2 image that was working, but when I wrote the imx8mq image to it from the releases link, it does not appear to boot20:55
joschusually there is lots of churn in the collabora stack20:55
minutethe collabora stack i'm familiar with, but there's stuff in imx8mq etc20:55
minutejosch: ah, these are patches on the dtses it seems20:56
+ bkeys (~Thunderbi@66.110.201.50)21:04
- L29Ah (PART: !!unknown attribute: msg!!) (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah)21:09
- bkeys (QUIT: Quit: With every step we take, danger will follow closely) (~Thunderbi@66.110.201.50)21:11
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- ephase (QUIT: Ping timeout: 248 seconds) (~ephase@2a01:e0a:2a:5300:37e6:956d:e15c:25fc)21:24
+ L29Ah (~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah)21:25
- bkeys (QUIT: Quit: With every step we take, danger will follow closely) (~Thunderbi@66.110.201.50)21:33
xktrminute: Is there something else I can try to work past the boot problem?21:33
+ bkeys (~Thunderbi@66.110.201.50)21:34
minutexktr: i'm testing this myself now21:37
- bkeys (QUIT: Client Quit) (~Thunderbi@66.110.201.50)21:37
+ bkeys (~Thunderbi@66.110.201.50)21:37
minutexktr: do you get MNT logo and uboot stuff immediately after turning on with that sdcard?21:40
xktrminute: No sir -- I only see the little display above the keyboard show the MNT logo, and on the underside, I see the bright white LED21:41
xktrI know the logo and uboot messages you're referring to, and I'm not seeing them on my boot attempt.  The display doesn't even seem to power on.21:41
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xktrminute: Thank you for helping me out, and for looking into this21:43
minutexktr: what was the exact command you used for flashing the sd card?21:47
minutejosch: is it a known issue on imx8mq that it doesn't manage to power off via reform2-lpc? (i recall a crash-at-shutdown-problem?)21:48
xktrminute: assuming the image is in /tmp, and I'm in /tmp:  zcat ./reform-system-imx8mq.img.gz |sudo dd of=dev/sdj status=progress21:50
xktrcorrection: zcat ./reform-system-imx8mq.img.gz |sudo dd of=/dev/sdj status=progress21:50
minutexktr: looks ok even if i always use bmaptool these days21:51
vagrantcmight need to sync the device to make sure all the data lands...21:51
minutexktr: does the resulting disk have 2 partitions?21:51
xktrminute: I did see two partitions on it afterwards21:52
xktrminute: Should I gunzip the image and try writing the uncompressed image instead of using zcat?21:52
minutexktr: i would use bmaptool...21:52
minuteyou can also try the beta 6.14 image21:53
xktrminute: I'm happy to try that out21:53
minutethat i just tested and it works21:53
xktrminute: And I'm happy to try a beta image if you could please provide a link21:53
minutexktr: bmaptool copy https://source.mnt.re/reform/reform-system-image/-/jobs/9543/artifacts/raw/reform-system-imx8mq.img.gz /dev/sdj21:53
vagrantcis it possible there is an old u-boot on eMMC that might not work correctly?21:53
vagrantcACTION forgets imx8mq a bit21:53
minutevagrantc: this is possible, hmm. but i think not if v2 image was the original21:53
minutexktr: where did you get the reform? 21:54
xktrminute: From CrowdSupply; I pre-ordered it after your announcement21:54
minutexktr: like, 5 years ago?21:55
xktrminute: Yes Sis21:55
xktrs/Sis/SiR21:55
minutexktr: well, i'd actually prefer sis :DD21:55
xktr(entschueldige)21:55
xktrminute: :D21:55
vagrantc:)21:56
minutexktr: ok so it's safe to say that it has one of the original batch imx8mqs with no emmc weirdness21:56
xktrminute: But yeah, it's one of your first units21:56
xktrminute: and re: emmc wierdness, I think mine is haunted.  I ran into a problem with my SOM, and you advised me to try ordering a 2GB one from Mauser which didn't work, so I ended up sending my Reform and both SOMs to you, and I think you replaced my 4GB SOM with one you had on hand.  I don't think you were able to revive the 2GB one21:57
xktr^^ the 2GB one seemed to give an initial indication that it was going to work, but I think there was a uboot compatibility problem, which wasn't your fault21:58
xktr^^ by uboot problem, I think the one that was flashed on the SOM proved problematic22:00
xktr^^ by boundary, not by the MNT crew22:00
minutexktr: ahh, so maybe we had to swap in one of the newer ones22:01
xktrminute: I think it's possible -- the one you sent back has been working since22:01
minutexktr: does it do anything when powering up with no SD card inserted? 22:01
xktrminute: Let me try that, and in a little while, I'll be able to wire it up to serial so I can get you messages from there too22:02
minuteneat22:02
xktrpowering on without an SD card also behaves as before:  mnt logo on the keyboard, blank screen, and the white LEDs underneath22:04
xktrI'll try using bmap to image the card and wire up the serial and report back later, unless there's sothething else you'd like me to try22:04
- wickedshell (QUIT: Ping timeout: 248 seconds) (~wickedshe@c-174-56-48-20.hsd1.nm.comcast.net)22:08
minutexktr: thanks, no other ideas atm...22:10
minute(except upgrading to RK3588 of course :D )22:10
xktrI would be happy to support your fine establishment with the purchase of some additional components.  I see that you have more upgrades and refinements from your first batch.  Should I log a support ticket to clarify what I need to bring my rig up to date?22:12
vagrantcthe rk3588 module is really, really nice :)22:14
- gustav28 (QUIT: Quit: Quit) (~gustav@c-78-82-38-134.bbcust.telenor.se)22:15
xktrI believe it!22:16
xktrI just expect that I may need more than the SOM, given how old my rig is22:16
minutexktr: RK3588 + protected battery boards and maybe up-to-date trackball i'd recommend22:17
minutethe old motherboard is still good22:17
minuteexcept if you want to go for USB-C PD with the new 3.0 mb22:17
xktrI have upgraded the trackball and the battery boards... and the side plates22:18
xktrI know the heatsink I have has an extrusion that makes contact with the freescale SOC -- would I need a new heatsink for the RK3588?22:18
minutejosch: austriancoder: etnaviv seems quite borked on imx8mp/6.14/mesa 25 ;/22:18
minutexktr: new heatsink is included22:18
xktrminute: Hot damn  :)22:19
austriancoderminute: more details please - ci is fine22:19
minutejosch: austriancoder: neverball is missing a lot of textures (i.e. the level is just a black object), glxgears is "dark"22:19
minutei'll make some screenshots22:19
vagrantcxktr: it does get pretty toasty ... mine hovers around 84C even when ambient temperature is much cooler :)22:20
vagrantcwell, at full load22:21
vagrantckernel builds in 30-40 minutes ...22:21
minuteaustriancoder: https://source.mnt.re/-/snippets/1522:30
minuteaustriancoder: actually the neverball level is not really black, it's just very very dark22:30
minuteaustriancoder: and the glxgears look like they just don't have any lighting/shading22:31
xktrvagrantc: oh no -- would I need to make adjustments to my rig to accommodate the increased TDP, or does that only happen when you're doing a lot of crunching?22:31
xktrvagrantc: If it's the latter, I won't worry then because my compute needs are very modest22:31
minutexktr: no worries, it normally only gets hot when doing a lot of number crunching, and it can throttle to manage the heat22:32
xktrACTION is relieved to hear it22:32
minutejosch: some reform-tools patching is failing https://source.mnt.re/mntmn/reform-debian-packages/-/pipelines/381822:33
austriancoderminute: images are not loadable - 40422:35
xktrminute: I'm still running my original JGNE cells.  Could I order some Eremits from you, vielleicht?22:35
minutexktr: we can't ship standalone batteries sadly22:36
minuteaustriancoder: ah damn, lets see22:36
xktr(verdammt nochmal)22:36
xktrI had to ask22:36
minuteaustriancoder: http://dump.mntmn.com/screenshot-2025-05-05-22-26-09.png22:37
minuteaustriancoder: http://dump.mntmn.com/screenshot-2025-05-05-22-25-53.png22:38
minuteaustriancoder: http://dump.mntmn.com/screenshot-2025-05-05-22-26-16.png22:38
minuteaustriancoder: eglgears wayland looks the same, so not xwayland issue... and it looks good when using LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE=122:39
minuteaustriancoder: mesa is 25.0.4-122:40
austriancoderminute: confirmed - not related to the kernel version22:43
minuteaustriancoder: nice!22:43
austriancoderminute: will do a bisect22:44
minutehm, only one pcie controller enumerated on our 6.14 kernel on imx8mq... that's a regression22:52
vagrantcxktr: yeah, that is peak temperature when doing lots of packages builds simultaneously22:55
vagrantcalthough still seems a bit hot ... makes me wonder about replacing the plastic bottom with at least a metal plate near the heat sink to dissipate heat more easily22:56
vagrantcrather than plastic which largely insulates22:56
xktrNow I'm wondering if I need to wait for that to show up on the MNT store -- heh22:57
- mjw (QUIT: Ping timeout: 252 seconds) (~mjw@gnu.wildebeest.org)22:57
vagrantcthe clear bottom is pretty great, but a little heat sink for the heat sink wouldn't hide anything that isn't already hidden :)22:57
minutejosch: are both pcie ports still working for you on 6.12 on imx8mq reform?23:03
joschminute: i'm using imx8mq with both the nvme and wifi card, so yes23:05
minutejosch: ok, need to find out what happened here, why pcie0: pcie@33800000 is absent under 6.1423:06
joschminute: did you try rebooting? Sometimes when booting, wifi is gone and reboot fixes it23:07
minutejosch: no the actual controller is not in the devicetree23:10
minutejosch: ok the issue is that it is using upstream dts23:11
minutejosch: because it looks like imx8mq-mnt-reform2.dts was deleted23:11
minutejosch: upstream dts is missing support for pcie0 on reform23:11
+ wickedshell (~wickedshe@c-174-56-48-20.hsd1.nm.comcast.net)23:11
joscho023:11
joschhow did it work for me then?23:12
joschi mis-tested then23:12
minutejosch: in your build you probably still had our own imx8mq-mnt-reform2.dts ?23:12
minuteok, how do i restore this...23:12
minuteprobably related to 67adfe793d89bce7397c9975265e53f0bf39cc5e ?23:13
joschminute: but you *did* copy over the imx8mq dts patch, right?23:13
minutejosch: no23:13
minutei wasn't really aware that we are now patching this dts23:14
joschminute: you do need to patch upstream imx8mq and a311d dts23:14
minute;/23:14
minutejosch: from where, 6.13?23:14
joschfrom 6.1223:15
joschlinux/patches6.12/imx8mq-mnt-reform2/0001-imx8mq-mnt-reform2.dts-multiple-fixes-for-display-wi.patch23:15
joschand there is also &pcie0 :)23:15
joschminute: reform-tools patch builds again in main23:16
minutejosch: aha, this also explains why lpc is not working23:16
joschyes23:17
minutejosch: thanks for reform-tools fix, will rebase23:18
minuteok pushed again :323:21
joschminute: anything else i should take care of?23:24
minutejosch: thanks, nothing i know off... i need to go home+sleep but you can see my checklist/progress here https://source.mnt.re/reform/reform-debian-packages/-/merge_requests/10023:24
joschokay, i'll upgrade my kodi box to 6.14 and see what happens23:27
minutejosch: do that only after my latest build though :D (because i didn't have a311d dts patches)23:29
joschokay!23:29
joschminute: maybe less work for you if i didn't mess up too hard here: https://source.mnt.re/reform/reform-rk3588-uboot/-/merge_requests/723:57

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