- XYZ (QUIT: Remote host closed the connection) (~XYZ@78-80-25-18.customers.tmcz.cz) | 00:50 | |
+ XYZ (~XYZ@78-80-25-18.customers.tmcz.cz) | 00:52 | |
- jacobk (QUIT: Ping timeout: 264 seconds) (~quassel@47-186-126-199.dlls.tx.frontiernet.net) | 01:14 | |
minute | a311d can decode 1080p h265 in software easily, i just realized | 01:32 |
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- Gooberpatrol66 (QUIT: Remote host closed the connection) (~Gooberpat@user/gooberpatrol66) | 01:44 | |
+ Gooberpatrol66 (~Gooberpat@user/gooberpatrol66) | 01:45 | |
- klardotsh (QUIT: Quit: zzz) (~klardotsh@98.97.112.82) | 01:53 | |
- mtm (QUIT: Ping timeout: 250 seconds) (~mtm@c-71-228-84-213.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) | 02:02 | |
+ sl (~sl@contrib.inri.net) | 02:04 | |
- mjw (QUIT: Ping timeout: 245 seconds) (~mjw@gnu.wildebeest.org) | 02:14 | |
- nsc (QUIT: Ping timeout: 244 seconds) (~nicolas@51-49-142-46.pool.kielnet.net) | 03:28 | |
- vagrantc (QUIT: Quit: leaving) (~vagrant@2600:3c01:e000:21:7:77:0:50) | 03:28 | |
+ nsc (~nicolas@66-97-142-46.pool.kielnet.net) | 03:30 | |
+ mtm (~mtm@c-71-228-84-213.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) | 04:08 | |
ex-parrot | ok I'm very happy, I've got vanilla bookworm running from LUKS encrypted nvme, xorg is working with glamor acceleration, poweroff works with the lpc module | 04:43 |
ex-parrot | battery measurement works | 04:44 |
ex-parrot | i3, firefox, glxgears all seem good | 04:44 |
ex-parrot | not sure to what extent xorg is "not accelerated" in this scenario but it seems pretty good so far | 04:48 |
josch | ex-parrot: what tweaks did you do to make xorg work? | 06:04 |
- ec0 (QUIT: Ping timeout: 260 seconds) (~ec0@vps-446f4f39.vps.ovh.ca) | 08:44 | |
+ ec0 (~ec0@vps-446f4f39.vps.ovh.ca) | 08:44 | |
ex-parrot | josch: just this config snip from https://community.mnt.re/t/classic-x11-with-config-file/1171 in bookworm | 10:16 |
ex-parrot | plus I added "SWcursor" "on" | 10:16 |
ex-parrot | to stop the cursor flickering | 10:16 |
ex-parrot | xorg at least claims to be accelerated | 10:17 |
ex-parrot | and I get refresh rate locked FPS in glxgears which is a good sign | 10:17 |
ex-parrot | I can post some log snips tomorrow | 10:17 |
- GNUmoon (QUIT: Read error: Connection reset by peer) (~GNUmoon@gateway/tor-sasl/gnumoon) | 11:00 | |
+ GNUmoon (~GNUmoon@gateway/tor-sasl/gnumoon) | 11:00 | |
+ Boostisbetter (4a410829d7@irc.cheogram.com) | 13:46 | |
+ eery (~eery@77.137.76.80) | 13:48 | |
Boostisbetter | Well folks, I can officially say that I am done even half supporting Purism. I don't think everyone working for them is bad. There are many really good developers there, but I am done supporting the company. Long live MNT. Thanks for the keep it real Lukas! | 13:49 |
Boostisbetter | for reference watch the latest Louis Rossman video if you are wondering what sealed the deal for me. | 13:51 |
eery | If I have some nearly dead lifepo4 cells, can I apply, say, a 5-10 volt DC current to help bring them back? | 13:54 |
Boostisbetter | I think I have read other people doing that. I remember thinking it was kind of a lot of voltage or maybe amps. | 13:55 |
Boostisbetter | Seems that it can work though. | 13:55 |
- mtm (QUIT: Ping timeout: 245 seconds) (~mtm@c-71-228-84-213.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) | 14:02 | |
eery | Yeah, it'll be a while before I can get proper tools or order new batteries, so I'm thinking I'll give it a shot | 14:04 |
Boostisbetter | well for your information, in case you didn't already know, the Reform is able to run without batteries and just plugged into AC mains. | 14:06 |
eery | Oh I know -- I just like working on battery, especially because all my mains connections are ungrounded, so I get tingly zaps when I touch the metal chassis while on AC power lol | 14:08 |
Boostisbetter | uh what. How are all of your mains ungrounded? Are you a mad scientist? 🙂 | 14:09 |
eery | The sockets aren't ungrounded themselves, they're just type j plugs (with a grounding pin) while my adapter only has a type f plug with the grounding contact on the ring | 14:14 |
Boostisbetter | ahh ok, that makes sense. | 14:15 |
Boostisbetter | Is anybody else bridging to this IRC channel via cheogram? How do you get it to stop trying to connect when there is an error? | 14:40 |
+ mjw (~mjw@gnu.wildebeest.org) | 15:12 | |
+ murdock (~murdock@dhcp-68-142-56-15.greenmountainaccess.net) | 15:43 | |
+ mtm (~mtm@c-71-228-84-213.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) | 16:09 | |
- murdock (QUIT: Read error: Connection reset by peer) (~murdock@dhcp-68-142-56-15.greenmountainaccess.net) | 16:14 | |
- unixpoet (QUIT: Quit: leaving) (~unixpoet@user/unixpoet) | 16:38 | |
+ unixpoet (~unixpoet@user/unixpoet) | 16:38 | |
Boostisbetter | Does the Reform have an end key? | 16:54 |
+ reform23287 (~gaston@81.173.205.18) | 17:13 | |
reform23287 | q | 17:14 |
- reform23287 (QUIT: Remote host closed the connection) (~gaston@81.173.205.18) | 17:14 | |
Boostisbetter | You just hold the hyper key or something to use it? | 17:20 |
Boostisbetter | Or are you trying to quit the channel? | 17:20 |
minute | Boostisbetter: no end key yet, but i want to put home, end, pgup, pgdn on hyper and arrow keys on kbdv3 | 17:59 |
- q66[m] (QUIT: Remote host closed the connection) (~q66matrix@2001:470:69fc:105::3104) | 18:04 | |
Boostisbetter | minute: ok, so there is no end key on the current Reform keyboard? Can we add a software update to assign this key to a hyper key combo, perhaps? Or is that would you meant with the kbdv3? | 18:09 |
minute | Boostisbetter: yes, no problem to put it in kbdv2 firmware | 18:22 |
minute | https://source.mnt.re/reform/reform/-/blob/master/reform2-keyboard-fw/matrix.h#L70 | 18:24 |
minute | instead of MATRIX_DEFAULT_ROW_6, you would write here the list of keys you want to have the combination of HYPER + the keys in the last row to yield | 18:24 |
minute | this is the default row of keys 6 https://source.mnt.re/reform/reform/-/blob/master/reform2-keyboard-fw/keyboard.h#L118 | 18:25 |
minute | so you copy that row over, remove the backslashes and change the keys | 18:25 |
minute | for example, instead of HID_KEYBOARD_SC_PAGE_UP sth lke HID_KEYBOARD_SC_PAGE_HOME, etc | 18:26 |
Boostisbetter | exactly. Very nice. | 18:37 |
Boostisbetter | minute: is there some way I could encourage more effort into the suspend issue on the Reform and Pocket Reform? For me this is an intrigal part of making the device useful, and I would happy to contribute some money to that end. | 18:38 |
minute | Boostisbetter: on pocket reform, i will invest a significant effort to make it work, anyway | 18:39 |
minute | Boostisbetter: for reform, i have a new patch that disables all the code that turns off the display bridge, i.e. on suspend or when reinitializing the display. it might help with the issue that the display fails to come on sometimes after suspend. | 18:40 |
minute | Boostisbetter: i had to do this because on a311d the problem was even worse: when switching between HDMI and internal display, or when exiting sway, the picture on internal display would be lost. the sn65dsi86 bridge would then complain about DP link failure. i believe this also happened with imx8mq when waking up from suspend? | 18:42 |
minute | with the patch, the display is never lost on a311d. i cannot test suspend with a311d yet though, because there is an issue with pcie on that platform--the nvme can't wake up from suspend | 18:42 |
sigrid | that bridge sure is sensitive | 18:42 |
minute | sigrid: yes, but in my experience the best thing to do is to turn it on and never turn it off | 18:43 |
minute | it tends to re-sync to a signal anyway | 18:43 |
sigrid | yeah | 18:43 |
Boostisbetter | minute: ok, it is good to see it is getting some love. That is an great to hear. I hope you are able to get some time on it to see if things can be improved. The solutions sounds it would work on the imx8 for sure. | 18:43 |
minute | Boostisbetter: i think in the next week we'll have this patch in the main kernel packages, i want to test it on imx8mq myself before rolling it out | 18:44 |
Boostisbetter | minute: sounds good. So far the work around you posted about on the forums has been working enough to be ok. | 18:44 |
Boostisbetter | Since the Reform handles resuming from a crash well enough, I'm not too worried. But it would be great to see an improvement there, as it really helps you to get right back into the workflow. | 18:45 |
Boostisbetter | Anyway thanks again! | 18:45 |
minute | sure thing! | 18:45 |
minute | and thanks for the offer of monetary support. i will come back to it if it necessity should arise | 18:46 |
minute | Boostisbetter: btw i found + watched louis' video | 18:46 |
Boostisbetter | minute: it is a shame, because I think what Purism says they are trying to do is a good thing. It is just the means matter, and not just the end. | 18:49 |
Boostisbetter | MNT has always been super straight forward with me, and I really appreciate. | 18:49 |
minute | Boostisbetter: have there been any reactions from the company? i was surprised about this very open attack | 18:50 |
minute | but we already knew from others about this questionable refund practices, i.e. josch | 18:50 |
minute | i don't think it would be legal in germany | 18:50 |
Boostisbetter | minute: Honestly, this sort of thing is what is said about them ALL the time. | 18:51 |
Boostisbetter | but they wording they use is correct, and as Louis says is sneaky and slimey. | 18:51 |
minute | so far we have always refunded anyone who requested a refund, but i can imagine that purism was maybe in a bad financial situation and really needed that "free loan" | 18:51 |
Boostisbetter | it means that it is legal. | 18:51 |
minute | ah ok | 18:51 |
Boostisbetter | minute: if they would have just been up front about it, and just said that they did it to do everything they could to keep the dream a live, it would have pissed off a lot of people, but would have been the truth, and would have won over more than it lost. | 18:52 |
Boostisbetter | minute: the other things that insiders have talked about is quality control. What personally happened to me and with others are all also all the same. | 18:53 |
minute | ah. this i don't know anything about yet. did the phones have QA issues? | 18:54 |
minute | but i'm surprised the money stuff was still an issue because they did this like $10 million public funding thing where they gave people a credit note, right? | 18:55 |
Boostisbetter | they have done that like 3 times. I don't know how true those all are. | 18:55 |
Boostisbetter | the phone has been super solid. Well built. It is the only thing that Purism has directly built. So the only thing that they were kind of directly in charge of. | 18:56 |
Boostisbetter | Their laptops and all are from a 3rd party that they make contracts with. | 18:56 |
Boostisbetter | That contractors screwed them over a lot, and Purism just passed it on to the customer. | 18:56 |
Boostisbetter | that is the kind of thing I mean. | 18:56 |
Boostisbetter | I mean all you see is bad press about Purism yet they are doing well and selling out of products. It is just crazy to me. | 18:57 |
sknebel | HQ in SF and >30 employees can go through millions quite easily, even before you go to the challenges of making hardware | 18:57 |
unixpoet | I had similar experiences with pine64 support, they *really* do not like to do refunds or exchanges; I had to threatem them with a chargeback to get them to respond | 18:58 |
Boostisbetter | yeah, I want to believe them, and i want to support them. But it is these things that are not getting addressed that just makes that almost impossible. | 18:59 |
Boostisbetter | The L5 is REALLY a good product that the devs have made a lot of progress on. | 18:59 |
Boostisbetter | But if I can't trust the company what does all of that matter? | 18:59 |
Boostisbetter | sknebel: the thing that kind of gets me as well, is that it is a US company but I think less than 2% of the company are actually Americans. Things like customer support, tech support, are all not Americans. | 19:00 |
Boostisbetter | sknebel: then they are all like this is a US made phone. | 19:00 |
Boostisbetter | If they are racking in millions why not pay Americans to do the menial jobs of tech and customer support? | 19:00 |
Boostisbetter | The whole thing just smells real fishy. | 19:00 |
Boostisbetter | and don't get me wrong, I don't care about companies hiring only from the company they belong to. I'm just saying that if you are using that as marketing and a reason to buy from them, it should matter then. | 19:01 |
Boostisbetter | the devs for Purism are awesome. | 19:01 |
Boostisbetter | anyway, back to MNT, and just desperately waiting for the Pocket. | 19:02 |
Boostisbetter | hahahaha | 19:02 |
unixpoet | imo steam deck > pocket | 19:02 |
unixpoet | unless you've got physical cartridges | 19:02 |
Boostisbetter | I'm talking about the MNT Pocket Reform. Not the Analogue Pocket. | 19:04 |
Boostisbetter | I love the Steam Deck though. But it is great for playing games, and not doing work. | 19:04 |
Boostisbetter | Also even though it is portable it is huge. | 19:05 |
minute | Boostisbetter: ahh i see, thanks for clarifying about the QA | 19:05 |
unixpoet | oh, oops, sorry :P too many devices | 19:05 |
minute | yeah, my partner has the steam deck now, it's quite remarkable. i'm also thankful to valve for putting all that effort into linux | 19:06 |
minute | i think analogue (pocket) has some really strong design / detail orientation, but i haven't seen one IRL | 19:06 |
Boostisbetter | minute: heck yes. Things run so well on it, and the average user will have no idea it is Linux. | 19:06 |
Boostisbetter | minute: I have one. It is just a Game boy of various models recreation. | 19:07 |
minute | about pocket reform, we are currently working on finishing the aluminum chassis, i.e. a rev 2 with that with reduced weight | 19:07 |
Boostisbetter | Not a laptop or desktop in anyway. I have one. | 19:07 |
Boostisbetter | minute: awesome!! | 19:07 |
minute | then i will do some spikes about power saving and final or pre-final rev of motherboard | 19:10 |
- GNUmoon (QUIT: Remote host closed the connection) (~GNUmoon@gateway/tor-sasl/gnumoon) | 19:11 | |
Boostisbetter | minute: are there still a lot of things that can improve power savings, or are most things already dailed in? | 19:12 |
+ GNUmoon (~GNUmoon@gateway/tor-sasl/gnumoon) | 19:12 | |
minute | Boostisbetter: currently the 2 rp2040s are always on, i think this can be improved | 19:12 |
minute | Boostisbetter: and the charging is a bit slower than i would like (compared to reform), i think it can be improved, currently it is the default setting of the charger IC. | 19:13 |
Boostisbetter | minute: funny, I was going to ask if it would be possible to slow charging on the Reform. In an effort to extend their life cycles. | 19:14 |
Boostisbetter | minute: I am under the belief that the slower you charge the less heat you create and the easier on the cells charging is. That probably is a gross over simplification of the whole process. | 19:14 |
minute | sooo the lifepo4 cells in reform are made for high current | 19:15 |
minute | liion cells usually are not that OK with a lot of current | 19:15 |
Boostisbetter | ahh so it is all good basically. | 19:16 |
+ jacobk (~quassel@2603-8080-b200-7b02-77cb-6304-f9db-dda1.res6.spectrum.com) | 20:42 | |
sigrid | minute: is the middle external usb port J17 or some other one? | 20:52 |
minute | sigrid: let me double check | 20:52 |
minute | sigrid: middle is J6 | 20:53 |
minute | sigrid: J17 is next to hdmi | 20:53 |
sigrid | ok, thanks. we are having some weird issues with usb happening in 9front | 20:53 |
sigrid | where connecting a mouse to one port, disconnecting it, then connecting to a *different* port breaks internal usb devices somehow | 20:54 |
minute | J6 and J5 go through USB hub, J17 is direct | 20:54 |
sigrid | they receive usb transaction errors | 20:54 |
sigrid | yeah that's what I wanted to find out, for cinap_lenrek it seems to only be the case with middle port somehow | 20:54 |
minute | hmmmmm maybe some EMI / voltage spike issue | 20:55 |
minute | does the power go out for the nonfunctional devices? | 20:55 |
sigrid | it doesn't seem so, so then it would make sense | 20:55 |
minute | hmm | 20:55 |
minute | what if one resets the USB hub (via the gpio)? | 20:56 |
sigrid | cinap is going to see hub status flags, maybe there is something | 20:56 |
sigrid | we only reset usb hub once during init iirc | 20:56 |
- eery (QUIT: Remote host closed the connection) (~eery@77.137.76.80) | 20:56 | |
minute | ok | 20:57 |
sigrid | thanks :) | 20:58 |
sigrid | I remember that internal usb devices sometimes (very rarely) would fall of in linux | 20:58 |
sigrid | but here we have a very easy repro, for some reason | 20:58 |
- jacobk (QUIT: Read error: Connection reset by peer) (~quassel@2603-8080-b200-7b02-77cb-6304-f9db-dda1.res6.spectrum.com) | 21:09 | |
cinap_lenrek | for me, its just the *MIDDLE* usb port | 21:40 |
cinap_lenrek | that when i plug in mouse, the front falls off on the trackball and reform keyboard | 21:40 |
cinap_lenrek | i added some debug stuff to our hub driver | 21:41 |
cinap_lenrek | when this happens theres no port or hub status change on the trackball/keyboard hub/ports | 21:41 |
cinap_lenrek | and everything works fine when i use a powered usb hub on that port | 21:41 |
minute | ok, sounds like overcurrent event maybe | 21:42 |
cinap_lenrek | yep, but theres no overcurrent event | 21:42 |
cinap_lenrek | thats the strange thing :( | 21:42 |
minute | ah, you can see that? | 21:42 |
cinap_lenrek | btw, the newly plugged in device works fine, regardless | 21:42 |
minute | oh ah | 21:42 |
cinap_lenrek | minute: yes, the overcurrent and power good is part of hub status field | 21:42 |
cinap_lenrek | as well as the port status | 21:42 |
minute | is that a special mouse? or happens with other devices as well? | 21:43 |
cinap_lenrek | no bits change at all in the affected ports | 21:43 |
cinap_lenrek | good idea | 21:43 |
cinap_lenrek | i should try it | 21:43 |
sigrid | I tried the same with a usb flash drive and it did not repro | 21:43 |
cinap_lenrek | same here | 21:45 |
cinap_lenrek | works fine with usb sdcard adapter | 21:45 |
minute | special mouse | 21:46 |
minute | what's the brand and model? | 21:46 |
cinap_lenrek | asus | 21:46 |
cinap_lenrek | its the tinies mouse ever :D | 21:46 |
minute | ah, laptop mouse? | 21:46 |
cinap_lenrek | the crazy thing is | 21:46 |
cinap_lenrek | it works fine on the other port | 21:46 |
cinap_lenrek | like the one to the left | 21:46 |
minute | on both other ports? | 21:46 |
cinap_lenrek | which is port2 on the hub | 21:46 |
cinap_lenrek | middle one is port1 on the hub | 21:46 |
cinap_lenrek | and the right one is a completely different hub | 21:47 |
minute | ok hm | 21:47 |
cinap_lenrek | so ???? | 21:47 |
minute | puzzling | 21:47 |
cinap_lenrek | maybe its a quirk of the hub chip? | 21:47 |
cinap_lenrek | man, i wonder if theres like usb compliance testing equipment for this | 21:47 |
cinap_lenrek | hold on | 21:48 |
minute | there is | 21:48 |
cinap_lenrek | so all i'd need is to source the 5v power lines from somewhere else no? | 21:48 |
cinap_lenrek | and just connect the data lines | 21:48 |
josch | ex-parrot: ah indeed, we are installing that file into /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d with the reform-tools package. Do you have that installed? | 21:49 |
sigrid | the hub itself can't really be controlled from the soc, beyond resetting via gpio, right? | 21:49 |
sigrid | like, the i2c(?) of the hub isn't even wired anywhere iirc | 21:49 |
minute | no. i mean maybe the overcurrent stuff is not reported correctly or something | 21:49 |
minute | on mb2.5 i use a different (a bit more primitive) hub and got rid of this functionality... | 21:50 |
minute | U15 and U16 are the chips that can cut the power to those ports | 21:53 |
Boostisbetter | has anyone noticed the mouse no longer reall working in DosBox with the Reform? | 21:56 |
Boostisbetter | never mind, I think I was sitting on a bunch of updates and hadn't rebooted. | 21:57 |
Boostisbetter | After a reboot the mouse is work normal again in DosBox | 21:57 |
+ jacobk (~quassel@47-186-126-199.dlls.tx.frontiernet.net) | 22:00 | |
Boostisbetter | minute: as for suspend and the Reform it would be good if we could power down more on the mainboard to net bigger power savings. This is not something all that crucial of course. Suspend stability is far more important. Just throwing it out there. | 22:11 |
cinap_lenrek | ok | 22:12 |
cinap_lenrek | can confirm | 22:12 |
cinap_lenrek | i can control the power on the ports | 22:12 |
cinap_lenrek | sigrid: echo portpower 6 2 off > /dev/usbhubctl | 22:12 |
cinap_lenrek | (for left port) | 22:12 |
cinap_lenrek | sigrid: echo portpower 6 1 off > /dev/usbhubctl | 22:13 |
cinap_lenrek | for middle port | 22:13 |
sigrid | is usbd supposed to do that when device detaches? | 22:13 |
cinap_lenrek | no | 22:13 |
cinap_lenrek | it doesnt do power cycling | 22:13 |
cinap_lenrek | but it kind of could | 22:13 |
cinap_lenrek | the issue is, usbd doesnt see anything wrong with the ports | 22:13 |
cinap_lenrek | it doesnt see any port status change | 22:14 |
cinap_lenrek | and the driver just gets transaction error and dies | 22:14 |
cinap_lenrek | well | 22:14 |
cinap_lenrek | the portreset is already handled by usbd | 22:14 |
cinap_lenrek | when you write "reset" to the deive ctl | 22:15 |
cinap_lenrek | it just sets the "reset me" flag | 22:15 |
cinap_lenrek | and usbd polls it | 22:15 |
cinap_lenrek | see portwantsreset() | 22:15 |
cinap_lenrek | we could have a portwantspowercycle() :D | 22:15 |
cinap_lenrek | tho portwantsapony() is a better name | 22:15 |
sigrid | heh | 22:17 |
sigrid | "Device Status Register This register indicates the status of the device controller with respect to USB-related events." | 22:29 |
sigrid | (C70Ch) | 22:30 |
sigrid | cinap_lenrek: was it that one you checked? | 22:30 |
sigrid | oh nvm, this is for device not host | 22:31 |
sigrid | PHY_CTL3_ADDR has some interesting bits | 22:33 |
sigrid | but I have no clue in all that | 22:34 |
cinap_lenrek | no | 22:35 |
cinap_lenrek | i did a standard Get Hub Status Request on the hub | 22:35 |
sigrid | I see | 22:36 |
cinap_lenrek | as well as a Get Port Status Request and just print whenever theres a change on any port | 22:36 |
cinap_lenrek | didnt do anything on the rootports | 22:36 |
josch | I watched the video you mentioned. I had the same experience except i went a bit further and complained about purism with the state attourney of california. That worked. Now purism tells me they cannot refund until my complained with the state attourney about my non-existing refund has been processed. Classic. | 23:18 |
josch | Boostisbetter: ^ | 23:18 |
Boostisbetter | josch: do you have a Purism product? | 23:32 |
josch | of course not | 23:32 |
josch | i requested a refund | 23:33 |
Boostisbetter | Was it for the L5? | 23:33 |
josch | yes | 23:33 |
Boostisbetter | And that is good. At least you have the reliable Reform right? | 23:33 |
josch | i waited so long that since i ordered, i got married, changed my name, moved countries twice, got a phd and got my first child -- this is too long of a wait | 23:34 |
josch | yes | 23:34 |
josch | i cannot praise mnt enough | 23:34 |
Boostisbetter | Absolutely! | 23:34 |
josch | awsome company and awesome product | 23:35 |
josch | will defintely buy again | 23:35 |
Boostisbetter | Yep going to be even better with the server and pocket coming down the pipe. | 23:36 |
+ klardotsh (~klardotsh@98.97.35.74) | 23:53 | |
+ vagrantc (~vagrant@2600:3c01:e000:21:7:77:0:50) | 23:56 |
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