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| Jookia | i just saw a teardown of the librem 5 by the CEO of purism | 11:11 |
|---|---|---|
| Jookia | they've shipped out full price units of the librem 5 running the imx8 | 11:11 |
| Jookia | with no heat sink or dissipator | 11:11 |
| Jookia | it's literally just the IC on the board | 11:12 |
| Jookia | their production solution is to underthrottle | 11:13 |
| Jookia | but there's no where for the heat to actually go | 11:13 |
| rvense | that really doesn't good | 11:45 |
| rvense | nor sound good | 11:45 |
| + erlehmann (~erlehmann@46.114.33.65) | 11:45 | |
| Jookia | yeah whatever it is, it isn't good | 11:46 |
| rvense | i | 11:47 |
| rvense | might even go as far as to say that i think it's going to bad. | 11:47 |
| Jookia | yeah that sounds about right. it's a bold move shipping them out to people, who again, paid full price for the phone | 11:48 |
| rvense | do you have a link? | 11:49 |
| Jookia | https://www.invidio.us/watch?v=74dhBddET2E is the official kinda teardown but earlier this year they posted some shots of the phone without the heatsink and i saw the same issue, though assumed it was just incomplete | 11:50 |
| - wiedi_ (QUIT: Read error: Connection reset by peer) (~wiedi@ip5b4096a6.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) | 11:52 | |
| rvense | ... they laugh about not having done drop tests? | 11:52 |
| Jookia | i didn't actually listen to the audio yet, i was just curious about the heatsink issue. but that's not great either | 11:52 |
| + wiedi (~wiedi@ip5b4096a6.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) | 11:53 | |
| rvense | "we have a running bet about who's going to drop it first" | 11:53 |
| Jookia | nice | 11:54 |
| Jookia | i'm also very curious about that battery | 11:54 |
| rvense | are they seriously shipping these to paying customers? | 11:54 |
| Jookia | yes | 11:54 |
| Jookia | they're shipping them in 'batches' so if you're an early adopter or just on the list to get a bad phone, here you go | 11:55 |
| Jookia | they mention for the next 'batch' they're going to ship it with a heat pipe but that looks REALLY awkward to do given how the cpu is sandwiched by two modules | 11:56 |
| rvense | yes, i just saw that | 11:56 |
| rvense | the company i work for ship imx6 based products in small cases and we have lots of thermal issues.. | 11:57 |
| Jookia | is that with a dissipator? | 11:58 |
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| rvense | yeah, there's this foam type material. and i think the latest version has a bit of aluminium. they wanted to redo the case for that, actually, because it throttles quite significantly under load, but it absolutely needed to ship so out it went | 12:21 |
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| mntmn | oh i missed quite some discussion here | 15:36 |
| mntmn | Jookia: didn't watch the video yet, do they have a lidded chip? | 15:37 |
| mntmn | i'm developing a massive heatsink for imx8m atm | 15:38 |
| mntmn | might put a emergency fan in there as well | 15:38 |
| mntmn | librem case looks quite nice though. i like how chunky it is | 15:39 |
| adjtm | mntmn, I agree with you, it's nice for a prototype | 15:42 |
| mntmn | what the hell, the chip is really naked in there | 15:43 |
| mntmn | how can that work | 15:43 |
| adjtm | when you said "lidded", do you mean with a metal lid? | 15:44 |
| mntmn | yes, there are lidded versions, but this one doesn't have a lid | 15:45 |
| adjtm | mntmn, for reform, my advice is to use a flat heatpipe and putting the heatsink where is more convenient for the case design | 15:52 |
| mntmn | adjtm: i have zero experience with heatpipes. i’ll look into it, but OTOH i already designed it so that the cpu is in a good place for cooling | 15:53 |
| adjtm | good then | 15:54 |
| slobber | interesting! | 17:02 |
| slobber | i have a librem preordered, but i opted for one of the later versions | 17:03 |
| slobber | i wonder how the community will deal with this issue | 17:03 |
| mntmn | slobber, are you in the librem matrix community? is there any place where the developers talk? would be interesting to share some notes | 17:35 |
| slobber | mntmn: nah, i'm on #purism though, talking about this now | 17:35 |
| mntmn | ok | 17:35 |
| slobber | idk if their matrix is synced with irc | 17:36 |
| mntmn | i believe not, there should be more serious conversation going on somewhere else | 17:36 |
| slobber | yeah the irc channel is very general discussion across all their products | 17:37 |
| slobber | i think they've got mailing lists too, but i don't follow them | 17:37 |
| slobber | so, heat tube is coming in the second shipment - birch | 17:37 |
| slobber | lol tube | 17:37 |
| slobber | pipe* | 17:38 |
| slobber | oh god they're targeting a day of battery life | 17:38 |
| slobber | damn | 17:38 |
| mntmn | that sounds pretty normal | 17:43 |
| mntmn | (will still be a challenge with that chipset) | 17:43 |
| adjtm | I don't think that i.mx series are designed for mobile devices, so it makes sense they are not the best for batteries | 17:45 |
| mntmn | yep | 17:45 |
| slobber | ahh | 17:46 |
| slobber | i'm currently on a newer nokia 8810, i get at least a week with it unless i tether | 17:46 |
| mntmn | ah yeah that's a pretty interesting device | 17:47 |
| slobber | but i guess most current flagship phones have the same expectation | 17:47 |
| mntmn | is it possible to write custom applications for it? | 17:47 |
| slobber | uhh i think there's some community around that | 17:47 |
| mntmn | slobber, my iphone 7's battery lasts 1.5 days maximum | 17:47 |
| slobber | i haven't looked into it too much | 17:47 |
| slobber | lol it's been a damn while since i've looked at iphones | 17:47 |
| slobber | battery life is going down over phone generations, it seems | 17:48 |
| ieure | Original iPhone had good life, it tanked with the 3G and hasn't really recovered. | 17:48 |
| ieure | Last two gens of iPhone have had reasonable / improving battery. | 17:49 |
| adjtm | the works device I have had regarding battery life was Nexus 4 | 17:50 |
| adjtm | specially using 3G | 17:51 |
| adjtm | but as I normally use 2G even with it I got 2 days of battery life | 17:51 |
| slobber | too bad 2g is shut down in the states | 17:51 |
| slobber | 3g is on its way out as well | 17:51 |
| slobber | what a mess | 17:52 |
| jfred[m] | <mntmn "slobber, are you in the librem m"> I'm in the Librem 5 room and I believe the devs pop in every so often (I don't know who they all are but there's lots of people with talk.puri.sm IDs in there) | 17:52 |
| slobber | ah | 17:53 |
| mntmn | jfred[m]: ah ok, gotta check it out | 17:53 |
| adjtm | slobber, in Europe most companies will probably shutdown 3G first | 17:54 |
| adjtm | most mobile phones support lte this days, but there are many iot 2g devices | 17:55 |
| slobber | ahh, nice | 17:56 |
| slobber | yeah, the shutdown of 2g is definitely a blow to iot crap | 17:56 |
| mntmn | isn’t 5g supposed to be the thing for iot? | 18:06 |
| adjtm | not for iot devices that only support GSM/GPRS ;) | 18:12 |
| adjtm | and 5G is starting in the high-end smartphone market that it's very lucrative, not in the inexpensive iot chips | 18:13 |
| khm | 5g is going to be a constant battle for years | 18:14 |
| khm | the carriers are going to get into fights with cities all over the USA | 18:14 |
| khm | their usual play is to get the city to let them install microcells on public poles and then make the city pay for maintenance | 18:15 |
| khm | lots of cities correctly foresee that this is unsustainable for them | 18:15 |
| khm | so 5G is going to be successful in dense urban but for everyone else it's gonna be a long, hard fight | 18:15 |
| khm | the real barrier to entry for these phones, though, is that you cannot use any US carrier's VoLTE service without getting your deviced approved and registered with each individual carrier | 18:17 |
| khm | this is currently what the Punkt MP-02 is struggling with, and most of these boutique phone projects are completely ignoring this | 18:18 |
| khm | so you can get data fine, but the minute you make a phone call, the device has to fall back to 3G | 18:18 |
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| slobber | khm: mp-02 is going to have 5g? | 19:46 |
| slobber | or | 19:46 |
| slobber | oh | 19:46 |
| slobber | i get it now, 4g is volte | 19:47 |
| ieure | Marse Volte | 19:49 |
| jfred[m] | yeah I'm a bit worried that the smaller mobile Linux distros won't be prepared for VoLTE when the 3G networks get shut down | 19:52 |
| khm | there are libre volte stacks available. the problem is bureaucracy. | 19:58 |
| jfred[m] | well there's that and there's the fact that most of the mobile distros are small volunteer-run projects with precious little dev time | 20:00 |
| jfred[m] | PureOS is the exception, I think | 20:00 |
| jfred[m] | (oh right there's Tizen and Sailfish too but I don't usually count those since they're proprietary) | 20:01 |
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